Claude C. Kenni (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
tothelight) wrote2009-10-24 03:05 am
tothelight) wrote2009-10-24 03:05 am
Entry tags:
IRC Log: June 2009
From a conversation with Nishi in the last week of June. NO ONE WILL EVER READ THIS
[Claude] anyway re: torture thoughts: it's not much :( just that your mentioning IDENTITY CONNECTIONS gave me some ideas
[Claude] especially if any plot events or games involve memory penalties in future or something
[Celena] ... Uhooo, it's possible, and a thing I've toyed with a bit
[Celena] Also, double Claude
[Claude] as it is, his main three connections are to Rabi (the original), Dusky and the "Claude" of his memories and the tube
[Claude] though he has several minor ones to almost everyone else he's met with in SLT
* Nishi nods.
[Celena] Cepheus is... actually really interesting to me in how close most of the team is. It... really goes fairly deep
[Claude] (if only Silver would thread more often I think we'd bond, too :<)
[Celena] Y-yes.
[Celena] Since he COULD be a really steadying force, considering all of us are sort of our own level of opposites
[Claude] I feel bad trying to analyze Claude so deeply since in all honesty for a protagonist he's remarkably well-adjusted :(
[Claude] AM I PROBING TOO DEEP FOR ANGST FODDER
[Celena] HAHAHA No, because fuck, if you can't question identity issues HERE, then where CAN you
[Celena] And Claude's already been jarred hard by the echo match
[Claude] welll, between Tavi, you and Red he managed to recover mostly
[Claude] although he'll still have his Doubts
[Claude] in the middle of the night, when he's lying awake...
* Nishi nods
[Celena] Because ... there's nothing to go on.
[Celena] It's that... is forward the /right direction/
[Claude] He's had memories that tell him he's okay, and that people like him, and he cared for people
[Claude] but seeing the HORRIBLE THINGS that others have remembered, he's also wondering where in time these events were
[Celena] .. the best part... is that means you're on stabler ground than anyone else in the group
[Claude] ....yeah pretty much
[Celena] ... Dusky's only memory of someone caring is someone who's convincing her not to starve herself
[Celena] (it got better, but you know)
[Claude] I think isolation would possibly do a lot of damage to him in that sense
[Claude] Claude is... someone who thrives on connections right now
[Celena] Yeah... while Dusky and Red are getting changed a little at a time by the fact that they HAVE connections
[Claude] in his important memories the key positive feeling is that of either "helping someone he is connected to" or "being validated by them"
[Celena] But.. yes. In a way, the connections are keeping a hold of identity and worth
* Nishi nods
* Claude goes to get that manga quote 8D
[Celena] >D
[Claude] okay so the original-based manga was a bit more SHOUJO-y and gave Claude slightly more negative undertones in terms of character
[Claude] this is what one of his party members says about him (to someone else):
[Claude] http://www.mibbit.com/pb/Ux1IPm
[Claude] (ty mibbit)
[Claude] From what I gather of his background, he was the sort of average guy who had acquaintances but didn't really have many close friends
* Nishi nods
[Claude] since he was always "the Admiral's son"
[Celena] It's at least good for Claude that the time with the Queen is pretty well erased.
[Claude] and his stint on Expel was the first time he got to interact with people who had no idea who he was beyond the himself they saw
[Claude] ....HAHAHA :(
* Nishi nods
[Celena] And to make a new image of himself?
[Claude] I-it's okay even if it wasn't he has some Comedic Invulnerability anyway
[Claude] well, the way things worked out
[Celena] Well yes. PRESERVING YOUR DIGNITY
[Claude] the first person he met saw him act on his own instincts
[Claude] i.e. he saved Rena from an attacking beast without thinking
* Nishi nods
[Claude] and though she mistook him for the HERO OF LEGEND etc because of his magical light-gun-sword, when things were clarified, she told him she still appreciated him for what he'd done as "Claude"
[Claude] ...and that was something he'd hardly ever gotten from an upbringing of "being capable because he's Ronixis's son" or "being appreciated, flattered and sucked up to because he's the Admiral's son"
[Claude] so it was
[Claude] special
[Claude] :(a
[Claude] (DISCLAIMER: I MAY BE COMPLETELY OVERANALYSING THIS)
[Celena] HAHAHA no, IT'S AWESOME
[Celena] YOU /KNOW ME/
[Celena] Character stuff is endlessly fascination
[Claude] I AM TRYING TO PSYCHOANALYSE A VERY NORMAL PERSON
[Celena] fascinating. EVIL FINGERS TYPE AS I WILL YOU TO
[Claude] fingerrrrs BETRAYING MEEE
[Celena] ... ... Claude. You're a main character in a Tri-Ace game
[Claude] ...I know
[Celena] Even at your UTMOST NORMAL
[Claude] but i'm still Very Normal For A Protagonist
[Claude] :(
[Celena] IT'S ABNORMAL FOR THE FACT IT'S REALLY UNUSUALLY NORMAL CONSIDERING ALL THE SHIT GOING ON
[Claude] ....this is true
[Claude] OKAY you mentioned making an image of himself that is a point
* Nishi nods
[Celena] (it's a fun tie in with Claude drawing the others and himself in the journal)
[Claude] ..I need to finish my Disc 2 replay but basically laaaaaaater in a dungeon he runs into points where he sees scenes from his past and has to face some realities about himself
[Celena] Which if you overanalyze THAT it's establishing an image... when you write down something or sketch it.. it's so you don't forget it.
[Claude] He drew in the others first because he wanted a permanent record that these were who were there :<
[Claude] (and he didn't draw himself because he had no mirrors)
* Nishi nods
[Claude] ...and then after he encountered his echo-self and got a good look at possibly the worst he could be, he drew himself in
[Claude] to record his self as 'not that other'
[Claude] ...if that makes any sense
[Claude] :(
* Nishi nodnods
[Celena] It does.
[Claude] RIGHT back to that dungeon thing
[Celena] YUSH
[Claude] so basically we see scenes of Claude's relationship with Ronixis and the life he had back home, etc, and in one of them he's being forced to be polite to a superior officer who's all wink-wink nudge-nudge pass a good word for me on to your dad, will you, etc
[Claude] and inwardly he realizes that he actually really really hated being in the Academy in general, and angry whenever things like this happened
[Claude] but he never said anything because it was easier to just ignore it, let things slide, and go along giving the general amiable impression to everyone
[Claude] he wasn't a 'nice guy' out of true compassion or understanding for people, but because he just wanted to avoid confrontation
[Claude] ...and in SLT, it's debatable how much either of those influences his niceness here as well >D
[Claude] So far, because most of the people he's met are good and friendly and likeable, maybe it's his compassion showing
[Claude] but people like Dera who are constantly abrasive? ....more difficult
* Nishi nods.
[Celena] There's no standards he's being held to... so the line between personality and conditioning is one you have to pick
[Claude] there has been at least one point when Claude has been very irritated/angry with Dera, but chose to walk away instead of biting back
* Nishi nods
[Claude] yeah, here he has no standards to live up to apart from his own
[Claude] but one's own standards can be pretty harsh, too
[Celena] And there's the fact that Cepheus has established itself as a neutral, helpful team
[Claude] And Claude is happy with that, because he honestly thinks that working to help each other is a better way to do things instead of being suspicious of other teams
[Claude] they're all here to gain memories back, but there's no time limit that anyone knows of
* Nishi nods
[Claude] and at the rate at which games come, most teams have a good chance of getting a win now and again
[Claude] granted, now with this many teams it may be less frequent, but the fact that recent games have given memories to more than one team is reassuring
* Nishi nods
[Celena] It's just that the memories themselves are not always predictable or comforting
[Claude] yeaaah
[Claude] right now, I'd rate the amount of subconscious pressure to win as soon as possible as 'pretty mild'
[Claude] since... they're managing life here, and he has friends, and it's an interesting place
[Claude] it has its dangers, but so far they've managed
[Claude] (of course he's missed the whole RAPTOR ATTACK arc so this'll change when he's up to speed again)
[Celena] HAHAH y-yes.
[Claude] Probably the thing that would drive him to aim for winning more would be if the physical/mental well-being of his loved ones were at stake
[Celena] Though it's really going to be muted down by the fact Rabi's going to pounce him and hug him hard for a long time
[Celena] In a way, they live.... pretty well, all considered
[Claude] ....I feel horrible because I'm going to come back and then hiatus again after a week or so
[Claude] ;;
[Claude] and for LONGER
[Claude] m-maybe I should give up on the Angel game...
[Claude] and just make it an incredibly long one
[Claude] but
[Claude] but it sounds so amazing ;o;
[Claude] team switzerland is the way to go
[Claude] Personally I think it's just the team getting all the good times in before the other shoes drop
[Claude] i.e. Dusky and Silver
[Claude] (and I don't mean literal dropping I mean...you know)
[Celena] Y-yes.
[Celena] Man, Dusky's going to be all sorts of complicated. I don't even know how it's going to go. But it's going to be INTERESTING
* Nishi scritches Claude
[Celena] You have to do what you have to do
[Celena] And if you LET yourself be here, you wouldn't get anything done
[Claude] :(
[Claude] can I continue rambling at you
[Claude] also replied SUPERLATE
[Celena] Absolutely :DDD
[Claude] haha yes INTERESTINGness
[Claude] I should sort out the finer aspects of Claude out on text to help me deal with that :(
* Nishi nods
[Celena] It's... amazing how much just OUTLINING helps sort things out
[Claude] since I already hit a few bumps dealing with the question of The Gay
[Celena] It took me doing a long ass essay to figure out how I was even doing the 'personality change'
[Claude] and sexual issues in general
* Nishi nods
[Claude] "the guy is 19 years old.......if he's a normal guy he must have hormones....or must he"
[Claude] outlining stuff goes EVERYWHERE though :(
[Claude] I'll start at one topic and meander through five
[Claude] ...also c+ping text from mibbit seems to end up in a continuous block sob sob
[Celena] HAHAHA it's the only way I GET SHIT DONE IS IF I OUTLINE
[Celena] And not necessarily, and not everyone who has hormones are OVERT about them
[Claude] okay he definitely has hormones since... one of the good endings is him and Rena on Earth and Rena informing him that she's bearing his child...
[Claude] ...I guess that's something...
[Celena] HAHAHAHA
[Claude] o-oh tri-ace
[Celena] SO YEAH. I THINK THAT DOES INDICATE HE KNOWS WHAT TO DO WITH IT
[Claude] I should play the first game too to find out what his mom and dad were like :
[Claude] :(
[Claude] well his dad I can figure from the game
[Claude] but his mom I have no idea...
[Celena] HAHAHAH who's the mom, Marvel?
[Claude] Ilia Silvestri?
[Celena] Ooooohhhhh
[Claude] she's one of the party members or something
[Celena] YAH
[Claude] he has her hair (sortof)
[Claude] and his dad's eyes
[Claude] ...she seems like she would've been a scary mom
[Claude] since she fights with FISTS
[Celena] YES SHE DOES. But she's also this hilarious dork
[Celena] And luuuuvs her wine~
[Claude] ...
[Claude] I must play the game and then imagine the scenario of her giving her son the Talk
[Celena] ................
[Claude] I BELIEVE IT WOULD BE HELPFUL FOR CHARACTERIZATION
[Celena] She'd start. And then Ronix would have to CAREFULLY TAKE THE SITUATION AWAY. And possibly Ilia
[Claude] Ronixis is an away dad mostly :(
[Celena] Well yes. It's hilariously appropriate because so far most of the game he's NOT IN YOUR PARTY
[Celena] But ohhhh shit when he is
[Claude] one of the flashbacks is tinyClaude telling his dad he hates him for always being away
[Celena] FIELD LEVELING SPELLLLLSSSS
[Claude] he is a MACHINE???
[Celena] Nah, he's got of the... father of a sitcom bearing.
[Celena] It's kind of hilarious
[Celena] Yeah, you NEED TO KNOW YOUR DAD WHEN HE WAS YOUNGER
[Claude] ...
[Claude] would you like second game spoilers or have you read my memories list already
[Celena] GO FOR IT
[Claude] The Big Bads blow up Ronyx's ship and he dies
[Claude] :(
[Celena] ... yeah. I CAN SEE IT
[Claude] ANGST
[Claude] aaaah dad issues
[Celena] SO YEAH. NOT AS ABSOLUTELY TOTALLY NORMAL AS YOU WERE SAYING
* Nishi scritches Claude
[Claude] see with a dad like that wouldn't you develop a bit of an inferiority complex too :(
[Claude] when you don't perform well, they wonder what happened to you, and when you do they say it's because of your dad, etc
* Nishi nodnods
* Claude is scritched prrt
[Claude] But that belongs to "Claude", not so much "Gold" or "Slim" in this case
* Nishi nods
[Celena] Which is the most interesting aspect of this rp
[Claude] seeing what happens when you remove motivations based on life experience and put them back in a mess >D
[Celena] That the things that happen now, can reshape the WHO... based on the memory. the ORDER they're regained, what they remember and the connections they have now
* Nishi nodnods
[Celena] YEeesssss
[Claude] yours sound much more dramatic
[Claude] earlier I mentioned in SLT the only standards being set are the ones he gives himself, but at the same time those standards can't help but be influenced by the people around him
* Nishi nods
[Celena] It would be interesting, actually, to know who they are might have been influenced if they had woken up on different teams
[Claude] because Claude is weak in the sense that, while he holds on to the "I am Claude, I am my own person, I shouldn't have to live up to a role set by someone else", it matters a lot what people he's connected to feel about him
[Claude] if he was someone individualistically strong, he wouldn't have cared that people thought less of his abilities for being the Admiral's son, and he wouldn't have followed his father's inclinations for him to join the Academy
[Claude] but he did, because he would rather preserve his connection with Ronyx than stand for his own self.
[Claude] In a way he wants to feel necessary to the people he cares for, or necessary in general, I'm not sure which.... probably the latter is not to as great an extent.
* Nishi nods
[Claude] being told that Claude is a liability, or useless, or unnecessary-- now that sets off sparks
[Claude] (especially if it's from one of the very people he's connected to)
[Celena] ... That would be more than a little rough, considering
[Claude] ...yeah that would be rough on anyone, pretty much
[Claude] (see? NORMAL)
[Celena] HAHAHA
[Claude] it's like...okay, let's boil it down to core ideas
[Claude] "I, as Claude, want to protect my friends"
[Claude] but then someone else manages to do that with far more ease, while Claude is beaten down by whatever the challenge is, and that someone else takes over his role
[Claude] so while he does feel that it would be better for the stronger person to take over, he would still go into a negative turn of uselessness and inferiority :(
[Claude] ....actually this is a pretty Normal Feeling too I would say
* Celena nods
[Claude] Everyone likes feeling needed! And most people consciously or subconsciously try to find a niche to fill
* Celena nods.
[Claude] but when those niches are occupied by people who can fill them better than oneself, one is at a loss.
[Celena] The differing point between normal insecurities and what might be is the SCOPE of the roles
[Claude] ...thank you for articulating it I WAS TRYING TO FIND THE WORDS
[Celena] HEH, NO PROBLEM
[Claude] and I think that gives me some idea of how to react to your future crazy 8D
[Claude] since
[Celena] Ohhhh
[Claude] broadly speaking, the main role he wants to fulfill is to Protect and Support his loved ones. And the most important aspect of this is preventing harm from coming to either physical or mental/emotional sides of them.
[Claude] If he can do that, he can accept that he's never going to be the guy who can kill lizards in one blow, or the guy who can turn wood and stone into tools in a flash, or the guy who can call up the elements whenever he likes.
* Celena nodnods.
[Claude] Those things do and may/will afflict him with a measure of insecurities, but to a more 'normal' extent, and he'll accept that the best men for the job should do the jobs.
[Claude] But failing in that Most Important Aspect would crush him.
[Claude] :(
[Claude] ...haaaaaaaard.
[Celena] Yeah, because you boil it down to the one thing you really idealize as strength... not to bend bars or crap like that.. but something that can support someone else
[Claude] YEAH EXACTLY
[Claude] man I can't word things properly ;o;
[Celena] YOU DO, I get what you mean!
[Claude] (it's a lesson he learns in canon, actually; that strength isn't about being able to defeat enemies more easily, but being able to protect people you care for)
* Celena nods.
[Claude] (....also I may need to get the log of this conversation from you ;;)
[Celena] HAHAHA, I can provide that <3
[Claude] so say like, hypothetically
[Claude] Rabi gets horribly mentally traumatized or somet-- wait this did happen but OKAY--- let's say Claude couldn't emotionally comfort him, but Allen Walker did
[Claude] it would be a double whammy since not only did he fail his Best Friend/Bro responsibilities but That Guy From Red's Background turned out to be the better friend
[Claude] if it was bad enough there could be jealousy to cover up his own guilt and self-loathing.... or something like that
[Claude] (...HOW NORMAL.)
* Celena nodnods
[Claude] and then it's possible he would begin his journey into the Dark Side etc etc etc.
* Celena nods
[Celena] Because it's easier to keep that bitter edge as an armor, value EASIER things, and look down on himself to justify it
[Claude] Canon does show that Claude is capable of jealousy
[Celena] (fortunately, in the hypotheticaly situation, it's unlikely to come about THAT particular way, simply because of how the dynamics are set up... Basically the only one in game Rabi DOES rely on is Claude. Allen is someone who relies on Rabi, instead)
[Claude] (gasp shock)
[Celena] HAHAH
[Claude] (.....wow has that dynamic really developed I THOUGHT ME AND RED HAD A TWO-WAY THING)
[Claude] (man I wish Rabi would essay more to feed my self-indulgent ego :()
[Celena] (IT COULD BE MORE THAT WAY, BUT IN A LOT OF WAYS, Claude's more stable than Rabi. And Claude being gone really shows it)
[Celena] HAHAH
[Claude] I think if Rabi hadn't gotten the mindfuck memory back it wouldn't have been so bad, since it was that that pretty much gave him the dependence vs detachment issues
* Celena nods
[Celena] ... in a way everyone but Silver has issues with dependance in one way or another
[Claude] ...silver's issues come from another planet
[Celena] ... well yes.
[Claude] anyway re: torture thoughts: it's not much :( just that your mentioning IDENTITY CONNECTIONS gave me some ideas
[Claude] especially if any plot events or games involve memory penalties in future or something
[Celena] ... Uhooo, it's possible, and a thing I've toyed with a bit
[Celena] Also, double Claude
[Claude] as it is, his main three connections are to Rabi (the original), Dusky and the "Claude" of his memories and the tube
[Claude] though he has several minor ones to almost everyone else he's met with in SLT
* Nishi nods.
[Celena] Cepheus is... actually really interesting to me in how close most of the team is. It... really goes fairly deep
[Claude] (if only Silver would thread more often I think we'd bond, too :<)
[Celena] Y-yes.
[Celena] Since he COULD be a really steadying force, considering all of us are sort of our own level of opposites
[Claude] I feel bad trying to analyze Claude so deeply since in all honesty for a protagonist he's remarkably well-adjusted :(
[Claude] AM I PROBING TOO DEEP FOR ANGST FODDER
[Celena] HAHAHA No, because fuck, if you can't question identity issues HERE, then where CAN you
[Celena] And Claude's already been jarred hard by the echo match
[Claude] welll, between Tavi, you and Red he managed to recover mostly
[Claude] although he'll still have his Doubts
[Claude] in the middle of the night, when he's lying awake...
* Nishi nods
[Celena] Because ... there's nothing to go on.
[Celena] It's that... is forward the /right direction/
[Claude] He's had memories that tell him he's okay, and that people like him, and he cared for people
[Claude] but seeing the HORRIBLE THINGS that others have remembered, he's also wondering where in time these events were
[Celena] .. the best part... is that means you're on stabler ground than anyone else in the group
[Claude] ....yeah pretty much
[Celena] ... Dusky's only memory of someone caring is someone who's convincing her not to starve herself
[Celena] (it got better, but you know)
[Claude] I think isolation would possibly do a lot of damage to him in that sense
[Claude] Claude is... someone who thrives on connections right now
[Celena] Yeah... while Dusky and Red are getting changed a little at a time by the fact that they HAVE connections
[Claude] in his important memories the key positive feeling is that of either "helping someone he is connected to" or "being validated by them"
[Celena] But.. yes. In a way, the connections are keeping a hold of identity and worth
* Nishi nods
* Claude goes to get that manga quote 8D
[Celena] >D
[Claude] okay so the original-based manga was a bit more SHOUJO-y and gave Claude slightly more negative undertones in terms of character
[Claude] this is what one of his party members says about him (to someone else):
[Claude] http://www.mibbit.com/pb/Ux1IPm
[Claude] (ty mibbit)
[Claude] From what I gather of his background, he was the sort of average guy who had acquaintances but didn't really have many close friends
* Nishi nods
[Claude] since he was always "the Admiral's son"
[Celena] It's at least good for Claude that the time with the Queen is pretty well erased.
[Claude] and his stint on Expel was the first time he got to interact with people who had no idea who he was beyond the himself they saw
[Claude] ....HAHAHA :(
* Nishi nods
[Celena] And to make a new image of himself?
[Claude] I-it's okay even if it wasn't he has some Comedic Invulnerability anyway
[Claude] well, the way things worked out
[Celena] Well yes. PRESERVING YOUR DIGNITY
[Claude] the first person he met saw him act on his own instincts
[Claude] i.e. he saved Rena from an attacking beast without thinking
* Nishi nods
[Claude] and though she mistook him for the HERO OF LEGEND etc because of his magical light-gun-sword, when things were clarified, she told him she still appreciated him for what he'd done as "Claude"
[Claude] ...and that was something he'd hardly ever gotten from an upbringing of "being capable because he's Ronixis's son" or "being appreciated, flattered and sucked up to because he's the Admiral's son"
[Claude] so it was
[Claude] special
[Claude] :(a
[Claude] (DISCLAIMER: I MAY BE COMPLETELY OVERANALYSING THIS)
[Celena] HAHAHA no, IT'S AWESOME
[Celena] YOU /KNOW ME/
[Celena] Character stuff is endlessly fascination
[Claude] I AM TRYING TO PSYCHOANALYSE A VERY NORMAL PERSON
[Celena] fascinating. EVIL FINGERS TYPE AS I WILL YOU TO
[Claude] fingerrrrs BETRAYING MEEE
[Celena] ... ... Claude. You're a main character in a Tri-Ace game
[Claude] ...I know
[Celena] Even at your UTMOST NORMAL
[Claude] but i'm still Very Normal For A Protagonist
[Claude] :(
[Celena] IT'S ABNORMAL FOR THE FACT IT'S REALLY UNUSUALLY NORMAL CONSIDERING ALL THE SHIT GOING ON
[Claude] ....this is true
[Claude] OKAY you mentioned making an image of himself that is a point
* Nishi nods
[Celena] (it's a fun tie in with Claude drawing the others and himself in the journal)
[Claude] ..I need to finish my Disc 2 replay but basically laaaaaaater in a dungeon he runs into points where he sees scenes from his past and has to face some realities about himself
[Celena] Which if you overanalyze THAT it's establishing an image... when you write down something or sketch it.. it's so you don't forget it.
[Claude] He drew in the others first because he wanted a permanent record that these were who were there :<
[Claude] (and he didn't draw himself because he had no mirrors)
* Nishi nods
[Claude] ...and then after he encountered his echo-self and got a good look at possibly the worst he could be, he drew himself in
[Claude] to record his self as 'not that other'
[Claude] ...if that makes any sense
[Claude] :(
* Nishi nodnods
[Celena] It does.
[Claude] RIGHT back to that dungeon thing
[Celena] YUSH
[Claude] so basically we see scenes of Claude's relationship with Ronixis and the life he had back home, etc, and in one of them he's being forced to be polite to a superior officer who's all wink-wink nudge-nudge pass a good word for me on to your dad, will you, etc
[Claude] and inwardly he realizes that he actually really really hated being in the Academy in general, and angry whenever things like this happened
[Claude] but he never said anything because it was easier to just ignore it, let things slide, and go along giving the general amiable impression to everyone
[Claude] he wasn't a 'nice guy' out of true compassion or understanding for people, but because he just wanted to avoid confrontation
[Claude] ...and in SLT, it's debatable how much either of those influences his niceness here as well >D
[Claude] So far, because most of the people he's met are good and friendly and likeable, maybe it's his compassion showing
[Claude] but people like Dera who are constantly abrasive? ....more difficult
* Nishi nods.
[Celena] There's no standards he's being held to... so the line between personality and conditioning is one you have to pick
[Claude] there has been at least one point when Claude has been very irritated/angry with Dera, but chose to walk away instead of biting back
* Nishi nods
[Claude] yeah, here he has no standards to live up to apart from his own
[Claude] but one's own standards can be pretty harsh, too
[Celena] And there's the fact that Cepheus has established itself as a neutral, helpful team
[Claude] And Claude is happy with that, because he honestly thinks that working to help each other is a better way to do things instead of being suspicious of other teams
[Claude] they're all here to gain memories back, but there's no time limit that anyone knows of
* Nishi nods
[Claude] and at the rate at which games come, most teams have a good chance of getting a win now and again
[Claude] granted, now with this many teams it may be less frequent, but the fact that recent games have given memories to more than one team is reassuring
* Nishi nods
[Celena] It's just that the memories themselves are not always predictable or comforting
[Claude] yeaaah
[Claude] right now, I'd rate the amount of subconscious pressure to win as soon as possible as 'pretty mild'
[Claude] since... they're managing life here, and he has friends, and it's an interesting place
[Claude] it has its dangers, but so far they've managed
[Claude] (of course he's missed the whole RAPTOR ATTACK arc so this'll change when he's up to speed again)
[Celena] HAHAH y-yes.
[Claude] Probably the thing that would drive him to aim for winning more would be if the physical/mental well-being of his loved ones were at stake
[Celena] Though it's really going to be muted down by the fact Rabi's going to pounce him and hug him hard for a long time
[Celena] In a way, they live.... pretty well, all considered
[Claude] ....I feel horrible because I'm going to come back and then hiatus again after a week or so
[Claude] ;;
[Claude] and for LONGER
[Claude] m-maybe I should give up on the Angel game...
[Claude] and just make it an incredibly long one
[Claude] but
[Claude] but it sounds so amazing ;o;
[Claude] team switzerland is the way to go
[Claude] Personally I think it's just the team getting all the good times in before the other shoes drop
[Claude] i.e. Dusky and Silver
[Claude] (and I don't mean literal dropping I mean...you know)
[Celena] Y-yes.
[Celena] Man, Dusky's going to be all sorts of complicated. I don't even know how it's going to go. But it's going to be INTERESTING
* Nishi scritches Claude
[Celena] You have to do what you have to do
[Celena] And if you LET yourself be here, you wouldn't get anything done
[Claude] :(
[Claude] can I continue rambling at you
[Claude] also replied SUPERLATE
[Celena] Absolutely :DDD
[Claude] haha yes INTERESTINGness
[Claude] I should sort out the finer aspects of Claude out on text to help me deal with that :(
* Nishi nods
[Celena] It's... amazing how much just OUTLINING helps sort things out
[Claude] since I already hit a few bumps dealing with the question of The Gay
[Celena] It took me doing a long ass essay to figure out how I was even doing the 'personality change'
[Claude] and sexual issues in general
* Nishi nods
[Claude] "the guy is 19 years old.......if he's a normal guy he must have hormones....or must he"
[Claude] outlining stuff goes EVERYWHERE though :(
[Claude] I'll start at one topic and meander through five
[Claude] ...also c+ping text from mibbit seems to end up in a continuous block sob sob
[Celena] HAHAHA it's the only way I GET SHIT DONE IS IF I OUTLINE
[Celena] And not necessarily, and not everyone who has hormones are OVERT about them
[Claude] okay he definitely has hormones since... one of the good endings is him and Rena on Earth and Rena informing him that she's bearing his child...
[Claude] ...I guess that's something...
[Celena] HAHAHAHA
[Claude] o-oh tri-ace
[Celena] SO YEAH. I THINK THAT DOES INDICATE HE KNOWS WHAT TO DO WITH IT
[Claude] I should play the first game too to find out what his mom and dad were like :
[Claude] :(
[Claude] well his dad I can figure from the game
[Claude] but his mom I have no idea...
[Celena] HAHAHAH who's the mom, Marvel?
[Claude] Ilia Silvestri?
[Celena] Ooooohhhhh
[Claude] she's one of the party members or something
[Celena] YAH
[Claude] he has her hair (sortof)
[Claude] and his dad's eyes
[Claude] ...she seems like she would've been a scary mom
[Claude] since she fights with FISTS
[Celena] YES SHE DOES. But she's also this hilarious dork
[Celena] And luuuuvs her wine~
[Claude] ...
[Claude] I must play the game and then imagine the scenario of her giving her son the Talk
[Celena] ................
[Claude] I BELIEVE IT WOULD BE HELPFUL FOR CHARACTERIZATION
[Celena] She'd start. And then Ronix would have to CAREFULLY TAKE THE SITUATION AWAY. And possibly Ilia
[Claude] Ronixis is an away dad mostly :(
[Celena] Well yes. It's hilariously appropriate because so far most of the game he's NOT IN YOUR PARTY
[Celena] But ohhhh shit when he is
[Claude] one of the flashbacks is tinyClaude telling his dad he hates him for always being away
[Celena] FIELD LEVELING SPELLLLLSSSS
[Claude] he is a MACHINE???
[Celena] Nah, he's got of the... father of a sitcom bearing.
[Celena] It's kind of hilarious
[Celena] Yeah, you NEED TO KNOW YOUR DAD WHEN HE WAS YOUNGER
[Claude] ...
[Claude] would you like second game spoilers or have you read my memories list already
[Celena] GO FOR IT
[Claude] The Big Bads blow up Ronyx's ship and he dies
[Claude] :(
[Celena] ... yeah. I CAN SEE IT
[Claude] ANGST
[Claude] aaaah dad issues
[Celena] SO YEAH. NOT AS ABSOLUTELY TOTALLY NORMAL AS YOU WERE SAYING
* Nishi scritches Claude
[Claude] see with a dad like that wouldn't you develop a bit of an inferiority complex too :(
[Claude] when you don't perform well, they wonder what happened to you, and when you do they say it's because of your dad, etc
* Nishi nodnods
* Claude is scritched prrt
[Claude] But that belongs to "Claude", not so much "Gold" or "Slim" in this case
* Nishi nods
[Celena] Which is the most interesting aspect of this rp
[Claude] seeing what happens when you remove motivations based on life experience and put them back in a mess >D
[Celena] That the things that happen now, can reshape the WHO... based on the memory. the ORDER they're regained, what they remember and the connections they have now
* Nishi nodnods
[Celena] YEeesssss
[Claude] yours sound much more dramatic
[Claude] earlier I mentioned in SLT the only standards being set are the ones he gives himself, but at the same time those standards can't help but be influenced by the people around him
* Nishi nods
[Celena] It would be interesting, actually, to know who they are might have been influenced if they had woken up on different teams
[Claude] because Claude is weak in the sense that, while he holds on to the "I am Claude, I am my own person, I shouldn't have to live up to a role set by someone else", it matters a lot what people he's connected to feel about him
[Claude] if he was someone individualistically strong, he wouldn't have cared that people thought less of his abilities for being the Admiral's son, and he wouldn't have followed his father's inclinations for him to join the Academy
[Claude] but he did, because he would rather preserve his connection with Ronyx than stand for his own self.
[Claude] In a way he wants to feel necessary to the people he cares for, or necessary in general, I'm not sure which.... probably the latter is not to as great an extent.
* Nishi nods
[Claude] being told that Claude is a liability, or useless, or unnecessary-- now that sets off sparks
[Claude] (especially if it's from one of the very people he's connected to)
[Celena] ... That would be more than a little rough, considering
[Claude] ...yeah that would be rough on anyone, pretty much
[Claude] (see? NORMAL)
[Celena] HAHAHA
[Claude] it's like...okay, let's boil it down to core ideas
[Claude] "I, as Claude, want to protect my friends"
[Claude] but then someone else manages to do that with far more ease, while Claude is beaten down by whatever the challenge is, and that someone else takes over his role
[Claude] so while he does feel that it would be better for the stronger person to take over, he would still go into a negative turn of uselessness and inferiority :(
[Claude] ....actually this is a pretty Normal Feeling too I would say
* Celena nods
[Claude] Everyone likes feeling needed! And most people consciously or subconsciously try to find a niche to fill
* Celena nods.
[Claude] but when those niches are occupied by people who can fill them better than oneself, one is at a loss.
[Celena] The differing point between normal insecurities and what might be is the SCOPE of the roles
[Claude] ...thank you for articulating it I WAS TRYING TO FIND THE WORDS
[Celena] HEH, NO PROBLEM
[Claude] and I think that gives me some idea of how to react to your future crazy 8D
[Claude] since
[Celena] Ohhhh
[Claude] broadly speaking, the main role he wants to fulfill is to Protect and Support his loved ones. And the most important aspect of this is preventing harm from coming to either physical or mental/emotional sides of them.
[Claude] If he can do that, he can accept that he's never going to be the guy who can kill lizards in one blow, or the guy who can turn wood and stone into tools in a flash, or the guy who can call up the elements whenever he likes.
* Celena nodnods.
[Claude] Those things do and may/will afflict him with a measure of insecurities, but to a more 'normal' extent, and he'll accept that the best men for the job should do the jobs.
[Claude] But failing in that Most Important Aspect would crush him.
[Claude] :(
[Claude] ...haaaaaaaard.
[Celena] Yeah, because you boil it down to the one thing you really idealize as strength... not to bend bars or crap like that.. but something that can support someone else
[Claude] YEAH EXACTLY
[Claude] man I can't word things properly ;o;
[Celena] YOU DO, I get what you mean!
[Claude] (it's a lesson he learns in canon, actually; that strength isn't about being able to defeat enemies more easily, but being able to protect people you care for)
* Celena nods.
[Claude] (....also I may need to get the log of this conversation from you ;;)
[Celena] HAHAHA, I can provide that <3
[Claude] so say like, hypothetically
[Claude] Rabi gets horribly mentally traumatized or somet-- wait this did happen but OKAY--- let's say Claude couldn't emotionally comfort him, but Allen Walker did
[Claude] it would be a double whammy since not only did he fail his Best Friend/Bro responsibilities but That Guy From Red's Background turned out to be the better friend
[Claude] if it was bad enough there could be jealousy to cover up his own guilt and self-loathing.... or something like that
[Claude] (...HOW NORMAL.)
* Celena nodnods
[Claude] and then it's possible he would begin his journey into the Dark Side etc etc etc.
* Celena nods
[Celena] Because it's easier to keep that bitter edge as an armor, value EASIER things, and look down on himself to justify it
[Claude] Canon does show that Claude is capable of jealousy
[Celena] (fortunately, in the hypotheticaly situation, it's unlikely to come about THAT particular way, simply because of how the dynamics are set up... Basically the only one in game Rabi DOES rely on is Claude. Allen is someone who relies on Rabi, instead)
[Claude] (gasp shock)
[Celena] HAHAH
[Claude] (.....wow has that dynamic really developed I THOUGHT ME AND RED HAD A TWO-WAY THING)
[Claude] (man I wish Rabi would essay more to feed my self-indulgent ego :()
[Celena] (IT COULD BE MORE THAT WAY, BUT IN A LOT OF WAYS, Claude's more stable than Rabi. And Claude being gone really shows it)
[Celena] HAHAH
[Claude] I think if Rabi hadn't gotten the mindfuck memory back it wouldn't have been so bad, since it was that that pretty much gave him the dependence vs detachment issues
* Celena nods
[Celena] ... in a way everyone but Silver has issues with dependance in one way or another
[Claude] ...silver's issues come from another planet
[Celena] ... well yes.